Posted in: Business

Applebee’s CEO Announces Hiring Freeze And Layoffs Over Obamacare, Boycott Threatened


The CEO of a huge New York Applebees franchise decided to join fellow fast food CEO John Shattner of Papa John’s in saying that he will layoff workers and stop hiring new ones if the Affordable Care Act, also known as Obamacare, is implemented. Applebees franchise owner Zane Tankel, announced his plans almost immediately after President Obama’s reelection.

The Twitterverse immediately went crazy with plans for boycotts.

One tweet read:

“So far I’ve seen Papa John’s and Applebees threatening to fire people since their choice didn’t win the election. Disgusting on either side.”

Others said:


“Add @Applebees to the list of unpatriotic businesses who are firing people because Barack Obama won.”

Zanr Tankel announced his plans on Fox News. Tankel is CEO of Apple-Metro which owns 40 New York Area Applebees. Each restaurant employs between 80 and 300 people. Under the Affordable Care Act any employer with more than 50 employees has to offer a federally approved insurance plan to their employees or face a fine of $2,000.

Zane said on Fox:

“We’ve calculated it will [cost] some millions of dollars across our system. So what does that say — that says we won’t build more restaurants. We won’t hire more people. If you have 40 or 50 employees at a restaurant, and the penalty is $2,000, and you’re going to pay $80,000 or $100,000 penalty, there goes the profit in your restaurant. I want to simply say we are looking at it, we are evaluating. If it’s possible to do without cutting people back, I am delighted to do it, but that also rolls back expansion, it rolls back hiring more people, and in a best-case scenario, we only shrink the labor force minimally. Best case.”

Papa John’s CEO John Shattner told shareholders this week he was going to have to add eleven to fourteen cents per pie to the final cost to the consumer.

Shattner was subjected to a whipping on Twitter for his comments as well.

Schnatter defended his plan saying:

“That’s what you do, is you pass on the costs. Unfortunately, I don’t think people know what they’re going to pay for [Obamacare].”

Because Obamacare’s insurance mandates only apply to workers working more than 30 hours per week, chains like Red Lobster and the Olive Garden have said they will look into cutting worker’s hours also.

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105 Responses to “Applebee’s CEO Announces Hiring Freeze And Layoffs Over Obamacare, Boycott Threatened”

  1. Vikki Schmitt

    So does the head honcho holding workers hostage because he doesnt like how the election went have consequences. Along with alot of others I will not patronize businesses where they are using the election to jack up their prices and treat their staff worse than they already do. In fact, I never did like Applebees and the one in our area is barely staying open only because they have always been overpriced and their food stinks. Let these places close down, others will replace them. No more ultimatums from the GOP!!!

  2. Paul Edward B

    Papa John's has lousy pizza so boycotting them is no sweat. Applebee's is no loss, either. The last time I ate there, my food was cold and the service was lousy.

  3. Wally Cook

    25 hours at Shoneys and 15 hours at Applebee's should net me what I have been used at one Job. extra gas to leave home twice. less sleep. 2 hours in traffic instead of only 1hour. Guess my ASS will APAPT, wont it???

  4. Thomas Duensing

    Government regulations also have consequences–but that little fact seem to exceed the comprehension abilities of many Obama voters. Would you rather companies go out of business or do you think that businesses have an obligation to employ people even if they can't make money? You have the Freedom to not eat there just as they have the freedom to run their business as they see fit Nobody is being "held hostage"–if people don't want to work there they do not have to.. We're going to be eating at Applebee's more often.

  5. Vikki Schmitt

    I bet you are. And who cares. If they close another chain of some kind will open. Like I said, save the ultimatums, you and your party both are all out of gas. And get over it, Obama won, deal with it. If you cant, join up with TX, they are whining about seceding again. I say let anyone who doesnt like it to leave!

  6. Julie Sokoll

    Within my own household I will be cutting back cause I will have to pay a extra tax and we already lost 5,000.00 of income since Obama became President and now I will have to pay another 5,000.00 in tax for healthcare I will never get to use. I am sick of taxation without representation. I'm sick of taking care of all these losers who have been on welfare for more than 4 yrs (some have been on it their whole lives). We will not be getting a new car, no vacations for the last 3yrs and that will continue. I now cut my own grass. I started canning and a garden this year. I quit donating unless it is a loaf of bread I now make and I now make my own clothes again. How many people would I be employing if I paid for these things to be done for me? Anyone who voted for Obama or believes this election was not vixed , I hope you loose your jobs like our families.Dumb Asses!

  7. Tina Marie Grubb

    We are all in the same boat, but if that is the sufferage, I have to do in order to move forward. I am not complaining. What does, when I quit have to do with it? That's right, I gave up working for the greedy a** h****. I have given up eating there as well. I will not support any of these large companies as they destroy America any longer. I will also never vote republican again. It is what it is!

  8. Vikki Schmitt

    Thomas Duensing Im not your honey and good thing you are just getting started, maybe by the year 2050 you might have a clue what is going on. I doubt it though, I really do. Your Republican party is for shit now, dont try to act like its together, there is so much infighting going on in that bunch right now, even billions of dollars wont fix it! You're a joke and so is your GOP. Like your loser candidate was a joke. Jokes and lies, lies and jokes.

  9. Thomas Duensing

    We're cutting back as well. No more union-related plumbers, electricians, etc. Why produce when it is just going to be taken away from us? Hang in there, you aren't alone.

  10. Denise Kaczmarek Riley

    Much like Chik Fil A, this might be very good for them. The opposition will now flood their restaurants.

  11. Vikki Schmitt

    Im not your honey so dont call me honey. And its good you are "just getting started". But if you had any real brains you would have "gotten started" a year ago with a decent candidate then maybe you wouldnt be on here defending some shitty restaurant and your loser GOP. Republicans are all stupid, every last one of them. Best you can do is look into Texas!

  12. Richard Hicks

    Elections have consequences. Most of their peasant workers who will be affected are probably dumbass kids who voted for obama or didn't vote at all, so the Hell with them.

    Good luck to the idiot libs trying to boycott every company that will be ditching workers over obamacare.

  13. Tina Marie Grubb

    Ignore the threats of the GOP, they have always been about fear. It simply didn't work for this time. Hang in there Dems do not give into their fear tactics. We can win this fight even if it is a long struggle.

  14. Julie Sokoll

    Funny you should say that, I just told my husband he has to put a wax ring on a toilet and and a faucet and if he wouldn't I will, instead of hiring. Yesterday I pulled an old round 52" table out of someones garbage and painted it and fixing a leg for one of my married children because they both work but can't aford a table. By the way they are both college degreed with 2 children to feed. I will take care of my own the best I can but that is it. Im sick and tired of piss ants that are so smart they are stupid!!

  15. Bridget Lausch

    I like how he describes the cost of the fine but doesn't bother to do the math on the insurance. In other words he has absolutely NO intention of EVER offering the insurance, he just plans on going ahead and paying the fines. What a POS.

  16. Thomas Duensing

    That repair is pretty easy to do. I'm not a very handy guy–we usually hire someone–but I've done that and it isn't very hard, just takes a bit of muscle.e

    Tomorrow, I'm dumping my Sirius radio subscription. It's become too expensive and I really don't need it. I can 't wait for them to ask me why I'm cancelling when I just renewed last month.

    Good luck to you!!

  17. Thomas Duensing

    When I here that some of them are boycotting a business, I make a point to gothere. I now eat at ChickFilA on a regular basis after what happened last summer.

  18. Thomas Duensing

    So you're blaming the guy for following the law? That companies would do that was predicted a couple of years ago after Obamacare was forced through. The government made the fine (actually it's a tax) less then the cost of the insurance itself. I guess you'd pay the entire thing even though a less-expensive alternative existed? Yeah, sure…..

  19. Bridget Lausch

    I worked in food service for 18 years. The owners are always looking to to make more at the expense of their employees. Tell me, why is it these people are so under the gun but much less profitable restaurants aren't? Could it be a difference in ideology?

  20. Thomas Duensing

    No, probably a difference in local economies. The guy is following the law as written and you're crying about it? Not everything is about ideology…sometime it's about keeping a business alive. Elections have consequences. Obama voters voted for more poverty, higher gas and energy prices, lower family incomes, higher unemployment. 4 more years of the same, immoral polices that are hurting working families. You could see the consequences coming a mile away. None of this is a shock to us.

  21. Bridget Lausch

    Faucets aren't difficult as long as you remember to turn off the water and don't lose any screws. My ex-husband had me do all those repairs around our house because he "knew I could". Not like he didn't make the cash to bring someone in it's just always cheaper (and more secure) to diy. I'm happy for the experience, too. It never hurts to know how to do something.

  22. Bridget Lausch

    So, yeah ideology. Do the CEO's want to take a hit to do what they should have been doing all along? Nope. They want their yachts and mansions that they earn from the sweat of others. Trust me when I say, republicans are doing much more crying than anyone else. This entire fiasco is directly related to the conservative temper tantrum that we absolutely knew was coming. As for four more years of poverty I suppose you'll blame the president and not the do nothings in congress. Such is life. Your ilk would spend a day convincing people the sky is down and the ground is up if that's what your "leaders" wanted.

  23. Bridget Lausch

    I worked two minimum wage jobs and tried to survive off them. It's not possible. Even if a person was allowed to work full time at both places it's still not possible. The solution to some is to make ourselves "more valuable" to employers. What they fail to understand is that less than 7% of the jobs available pay enough to live on. Since those able to create jobs are much more hung up on themselves and their huge houses and their leer jets or whatever multi-billionaires float around in it looks like us "regular" people have to make a choice. Do we cave and start infighting, thereby serving the purpose of distracting us from what matters (the astounding levels of corporate greed and denial of corporate responsibility) or do we band together and take notice when congress doesn't do it's job or when companies don't care about their workers?

  24. Tina Marie Grubb

    Bridget, I for one am standing up, we have been in denial far to long. I realize that we will suffer, however, we are suffering anyway. I know it is a lot to ask and they can probably outlast us because they have more resources, but their greed gets the best of them.

  25. John Smith

    Democrats, why do you think these business owners are "bluffing"? The election is over. They are just pointing out legitimate business costs that will make it more difficult or impossible to make a profit. Cutting back hours to < 30 is one possible way that everyone can keep their jobs. But it's just incredibly naive to think that all business owners are just swimming in caviar and champagne, and can afford any cost increase w/impunity.

    This is the real world, owners have to make payroll. Ask any restaurant owner, talk to them yourself and see how this will affect them.

    This is only starting, it's not just right-wing business owners that are upset. ALL of these businesses are going to get the same costs.

    After 2 years of this, or 4, let's see how much pressure Democrats can take after Americans know the real effects of Obamacare.

  26. Kristen Petitta-Frankovich

    Why are they acting surprised? Who did they think would foot the bill?

  27. Ed Culligan

    Probably going to lose my job over this. I make medical devices and we are the first ones hit. It's scary when you have a family and they depend on you.

  28. Ed Culligan

    Timothy R Fox It's going to be a long road buddy. I wish Healthcare costs could come down for people I really do. This could have been thought out by both sides. Instead they subsidize it and add millions to insurance thinking premiums will go down. Now Premiums are up 30% and growing. Since employers are laying people off and premiums are going up you can bet the Government will step in. This was the plan in the first place. Bankrupt insurance companies and we take over. All I can do is laugh at the stupid liberals that voted for this.

  29. Kimberly Huddle Brouillette


  30. Cathy DeWalt

    I always liked to eat at Applebee's…now I can add it to the list of business run by whiney babies. They are greedy, unpatriotic, racist pigs…they make record profits and when they can't buy an election, take it out on those who give them their blood, sweat and tears for crappy wages! These guys should be ashamed of themselves and I can't see how they can sleep at night!

  31. Pamela McCoy

    Costs of insurance premiums are increasing (for companies) even more than the fines for not having insurance, due to the fact that insurance companies are no longer legally allowed to mitigate their risks. Nothing is free – not even healthcare. Santa and the Easter Bunny do not exist either.

  32. Pamela McCoy

    It's only a matter of time. Some companies are smart enough to be proactive in saving their businesses.

  33. Carol A Muratore

    I hope you will not become one of those "losers" who needs welfare. It must be nice to be albe to have just one person to blame for all the problems of the country. There must be one word to define this phenomenom: Simple.

  34. Vince Bottone

    papa john himself is worth 600 million dollars and lives in a 66 thousand square foot 147 million dollar compound but yet he cant afford to offer his workers health insurance and would rather raise the price of pizza and cut workers…..another greedy business owner..if I had 5 million id hate to give 500 k of it away too but o well..I hope obama taxes them thru the roof…and if they are found with money in other countries tax that outrageously too…and if they make it overseas and bring it over tax that outrageously too…i don't want to hear that he worked for it either…good for him.

  35. Joseph Berndt

    With your fucking selfish attitude, I have to say that I am glad to hear that you are making less than what you use to make. Blame it on your self, because you are stupid enough to vote Republican and they are completely responsible for your situation. Their policies caused it. Employers should pay a living wage and healthcare and stop treating their workers like crap. There is no sympathy here for those crooked employers that blame Obama care for sometlhing they should have already been doing. Greedy bastards. And you are no better. If you don't like Obama, then leave the country. We won't miss you. Taxes have never been lower. Under Nixon the marginal tax rate rate was 70% and under Eisenhower is was 90%. Think about it before you wine some more.

  36. Jennifer Herrgesell Baker

    It's business Cathy. OWNERS can run their business however they choose. This is still a free country. You're the one whining about how businesses should run. If you don't like it, eat elsewhere. You obviously are watching too much left wing tv. Take a class in simple Econ 101 so you can understand how businesses work. I'm sure your wonderful state of CA can help you out in that department. ….fruits and nuts!

  37. Bridget Lausch

    I'm not so sure it's all that stupid. If you are willing to consider the amount of money insurance companies waste it seems only appropriate that they let the government waste it instead. You know what, the hell with it. Anarchy for all. 😉

  38. Bridget Lausch

    The sad part is HE didn't work for it. At least not for the last fifteen years. He's sat in a boardroom and controlled the lives of his workers which is as it should be. At all my kitchen jobs we referred to the owner as "our owner". Care to venture a guess as to why? Papa's employees? They just got a bad owner.

  39. Bridget Lausch

    In this case they aren't losing money. He can deduct the expense (at least a nice chunk of it) from his operating costs. This is about politics. It has less to do with money than perhaps anyone, anywhere, really understands.

  40. Shaun Phalen Tracy

    Yep Obama won…deal with it…go boycott. See how that works out for you! And no, another business will not necessarily take their place…do you know how hard it is to start a business right now with all of govt's rules and regulations?? We used to be able to offer free healthcare and other benefits, but then the govt stepped in and decided to tax us on the benefits we were giving you. So who is benefiting now?? Obama is not for small business, so don't expect to see new businesses popping up everywhere…expect more to close!! And you can't make us leave because we have free speech in this country…at least for now. And it seems to me, you were the one whining about not having all the freebies…we're just explaining to you why it isn't feasible and why it won't happen without severe consequences. Those of us that have healthcare, is because we took the initiative to save the money for it, instead of buying big screen tvs and cellphones and who knows what else. You, on the other hand feel entitled to it because you feel it is a right. You have the right to pursue happiness, so with that in mind, you have to make hard choices about what is important…your health or your stuff. And if you think that the govt is so good at running things, tell me one entity that they have run well, and then tell me, if you are willing to give your health decisions to such govt…I'm not!!

  41. Shaun Phalen Tracy

    Bridget Lausch We can no longer deduct the expense for healthcare or other benefits like in previous years. Govt has decided to tax us on those benefits now. So where do we pass the cost? Do you run a business? If so, I'dlike to hear how you pass this off as a business expense in today's world.

  42. Shaun Phalen Tracy

    And he didn't put any of his own money, risk and time into it, did he? What have you put up to start a business? Have you ever had to make a payroll, pay vacations for people, buy the food to sell, pay rent to the land owners, pay franchise fees and a percentage of your profits back to the parent company? Have you had to deal with unemployment claims, stealing from employees, hgiher taxes from the government (one of which is taxing us to give you benefits that we used to give to you for free?). Have you had to train and staff people, deal with customer complaints if you weren't fast enough, remodel and re-invest in your stores so they are up-to-date? Have you had to pay insurance for malpractice, or lawsuits?? Where do you think this comes from anyway?? Profits have to pay for all of these things!! Unless you have run a business and understand how economics work and how profits have to be put back into a company to keep it running successfully, your complaining means nothing. I am sick of the mentality that govt has thrown on our young people, that anyone that makes a profit is greedy. Why isn't it considered greedy to want to take from the very people that hired you and gave you an opportunity? anyone can advance themselves if they try…but most people don't want to take the risk or responsibility. We wouldn't be on these computers if someone very well known didn't take a risk with his money and time in his basement, yet you want to squash entrpreneurism. Capitalism works and it can work for everyone if they put in the effort to better themselves.

  43. Vince Bottone

    Capitalism doesnt work as well as you think because wealth doesnt trickle downhill if the business owners dont want it to….minimum wage already isnt cutting it …10 years from now non business owners will be working slaves and thats what capitalst do they capitalize on things…pay the people that help you make your hundreds and millions a livable wage….I agree hes very successful and thats good for him and after all those things you rattled off hes still worth a half a billion dollars.. stop trying to stick it to the consumers and workers that you can clearly afford to pay more

  44. Shaun Phalen Tracy

    It's ok if you disagree with me…I can't force you to be right.

  45. Bridget Lausch

    I'm not a business owner, I used to do taxes with H+R Block. If you own a small business you don't have nearly as much to worry about as you may think.

  46. Shaun Phalen Tracy

    Thanks for the vote of confidence, but until you are in the shoes of a business owner, you have no leg to stand on. Go work for H&R block this year AND hang around for the next few and see if your view changes. We shouldn't need a tax advisor to do our taxes either…the tax code is insane.

  47. Bridget Lausch

    The tax code IS insane. I was with them for four years and every year pub. 17 got a little stranger. I learned almost more than any average American ought to know about how rich (I mean really rich. like ostentatiously, obnoxiously rich) people get that way and stay that way. It's all too frequently on the backs of and at the expense of "the rest of us". I've been known to espouse both the greatness and the evils of capitalism. It's nothing without consumerism. And nothing next to investments.

  48. Shaun Phalen Tracy

    How is it on the backs of other people?? We all paid for the taxes for the roads and bridges and whatever else people want to spew, so I don't need to hear any more of that baloney. Some people just decided to step outside their comfort zone and make things happen for themselves and now govt wants people to believe that the American Dream is a bad thing. Do you know the actual story of how Papa Johns started? What he sold, gave up and actually DID to start his business? Look it up and then tell me how many people you know would have or still would take the time and energy to do what he did. He deserves whatever he has gotten…no one forced anyone to buy his pizzas…they bought them because they liked them. Free enterprise is all about competition, so people actually can choose who they want to patronize. Govt can not offer that..they just want to demonize, which doesn't make sense to me, because in the process of trying to close down many of these businesses, they are losing lots and lots of revenue, changing the landscape of our economy even further.

  49. Shaun Phalen Tracy

    Just bought a Papa Johns pizza to show my support for him as an entrepreneur successful private business. We will enjoy it immensely!

  50. Paul Edward B

    Enjoy it, but understand that your "Freedom Pizza" came with the help of socialist infrastructure. The water used in the pizza came through socialist provided water lines and purification plants. The electricity provided by a government regulated industry that ensured electrification across the country. The Papa John's delivery trucks delivering the ingredients (subsidized by agricultural subsidies and protected by the FDA) drove across socialist roads. Also, the "slaves" who made the pizza, and ensured that they weren't too stupid to mess it up, had a government subsidized education that "Poppy John" didn't have to break open his wallet to train so they could read. So, yes, enjoy your pizza because we all know that this successful and private businessman absolutely, not once, did not rely upon the government to help make his fortune.

  51. Tina Oliver

    Good luck with your heart disease and type a diabetes :) That'll teach me!

  52. Shaun Phalen Tracy

    LOL What do you think the taxes we ALL pay for go to!!! You act like no one that made it big ever had to pay taxes!! I feel sorry for you and all your ignorant ranting, and I truly enjoyed my pizza!! We may be the minority as people like you tend to say, but we pay most of the taxes, and you'll miss us when the dough quits coming in!! Pun intended!!

  53. Paul Edward B

    As a taxpayer, I appreciate you, and the 1%, for paying taxes for The Commons, but you have to pay more. Because The Commons have afforded you the means of which to produce your wealth, and you have used a larger majority and quantity of them, it is appropriate that you pay a larger share. I thinking owing up to the responsibility of The Commons, and not relying upon corporate welfare and handouts, will make the 1% more appreciated in this country.

  54. Bob Cipnic

    Ahh, America, where the most impotant freedom our brave men & women died for is apparently the freedom to be a nation full of selfish, greedy S.O.B.s ! It's in the hallowed Founding Documents, somewhere, isn't it, my conservative counterparts ? Please show me, so I can switch philosophical sides and be so cavalier about not doing more to help your fellow citizens even though you reasonably could at little or no risk to your own financial situation.

    You say 'peasant worker' like you are somehow a superior being to those of us who have spent our lives working in retail & service industries (I'm a Receiving Manager for a national retailer with 1000 or so outlets, so I know all about calling employees 'seasonal' or 'part-time'). I'm sure you're happy to not have to do those types of jobs yourself, but I'm willing to bet you avail yourself of our services. You're unwilling to support paying an extra few cents for a pizza or a lousy Applebee's meal to make sure that servers, warehouse workers & the like can get a fair insurance deal through employer-supported plans OR pay a few more bucks in taxes so the state can help those people .

    If it were actually a case of these businesses being forced to close due to the ACA regs, it'd be one argument, but that doesn't seem to be the case here. Neither Papa John's nor Applebee's is in danger of closing down, just becoming less profitable.

  55. Bob Cipnic

    Shaun, you don't have a large tv or a cell phone ? Even I had to finally get a cell phone, and I'm a bit of a communications luddite. And what qualifies as a big-screen TV these days ? I've had the same 55" for 16 years now. Paid cash BTW.

    Also, you say 'we used to be able to offer' …. who is 'we' ? Did you own a business ? Are you speaking from first-hand experience ?

    I am a tax-paying citizen. Always have been, never on welfare – but we did have food stamps as a kid. I support all of those social programs. Sure, I'd like to see them be better administered, but I'm not going to starve the needy to spite the few who take advantage of the government system.

    Before I'd give up on the social programs, I'd like to try some simple things like maybe collecting payroll tax from all earnings, not just the first $120K or whatever. And means-testing programs – if you've got six figures of retirement income rolling in (investments, pensions, etc.), you are in my book already 'Socially Secure' and should not be eligible for payments from my taxes.

    And to further cloud your thinking, if all these so-called freeloaders 'need' to be working, what is it we really 'need' them to do ? Make & sell us more crap we can throw away in a year when the new version comes out ? Businesses already are phasing out people in favor of machines & automation to file, cashier, etcetera – what will your 'no food or shelter without working' philosophy come up with to keep society intact as this trend continues ? Especially when you usually don't pay people in service jobs – likely the only place for non-machine expansion – what they deserve .

  56. Vikki Schmitt

    Bob Cipnic There is a very distinct difference in logic shown by the Obama supporters and the Romney drones. Inferring that people who have health insurance have it as the result of saving their pennies and passing on the big screen tv's and cellphones is bullcrap. So is implying that folks who dont have coverage elected not to so they could instead buy big tvs and cellphones. Most everyone with coverage has it through their place of employment, I dont know ANYONE who buys it as a family deal or the like, even people I know with small businesses the spouse usually works somewhere to get the health benefits so they dont have to buy them. These Republicans are, simply put, full of shit with their claims. Big reason why they lost the election. They cant tell the truth for the life of themselves!

  57. Thomas Duensing

    My party? And which party is that? Keep your greed and envy out of other people's lives. It is immoral to demand something you didn't earn. Grow up, and learn the difference between right and wrong.

  58. Thomas Duensing

    Statists like Cathy want to dictate to everyone else how people should live or run their lives and businesses–the very definition of Tyranny. Their religion is big government.

  59. Thomas Duensing

    Minimum wage was never intended to be a "living wage". You hate people who are more successful than you as shown by your greedy desire to want something you did not earn.

  60. Thomas Duensing

    I just do not understand why you Libs posting here have so much hate and greed in your hearts. I can tell many of you have not run or owned a business because you act like the owners don't have to do anything to make it a success–it's all because of the Proletariats, right? And yes, I will blame your president for the poverty. Shouldn't he be doing things to get people out of poverty like he has for the past 4 years? Oh wait, poverty and incomes are down. Oops. It's all about the freebies and wanting something for free that you did not earn. Baracka Clause is coming to town baby–the problem is, your neighbors will have to pay for your free stuff….

  61. Vince Bottone

    then dont blame people who arent successful and need to rely on the government for "free" stuff…like it or not were all in it together.

  62. Bob Cipnic

    When did Vikki (no other responder used "your party") demand anything, Thomas ? What in her post indicates greed & envy ?

  63. Bob Cipnic

    It's actually defined simply as "an excessive desire for acquiring & attaining" , having nothing to do with who 'produces' or 'earns' it. It's simply about volume & desire, if I read it right. Wanting to earn & accumulate massive fortunes – even by legitimate means – does qualify, you know.

    One of the Sins to be avoided, I believe, if you traffic in that sort of superstition.

    I feel that greed is also keeping & using more of society's shared resources than one could reasonably need when others have none or very little. I could debate what 'reasonably' & 'shared resources' mean in this context, but if you don't agree with the broader definition of 'greed', no point.

  64. Shaun Phalen Tracy

    LOL…so now you are The Commons?? How degrading for you to consider yourself as such.

  65. Paul Edward B

    Seriously. That's it? At least copy and paste some comments from Milton Friedman for crying out loud.

  66. Bridget Lausch

    You keep blaming the "libs". Of the top ten states collecting "free" stuff eight of them are red. Small business owners have to work way too hard in comparison to the huge multimillion dollar corporations that are too cheap to offer so much as aspirin and band aids to their employees. The problem in this country is indeed hatefulness and greed but it's all coming from the same place as it was before. Greedy people that want ten million dollar homes at the expense of minimum wage workers. Then those same people want to complain when there's not enough cash flowing out of the minimum wage workers homes and back in to the capitalist system. The economy is a circle, not a straight line. People seem to forget that if employees don't have any money they won't spend any money.

  67. Thomas Duensing

    She calls people who earn their own money and want to keep it "greedy". The definition of "greed" is when someone wants something they did not earn/do not have. Her posts on this page speak for themselves.

  68. Bridget Lausch

    You've obviously never worked in food service. Or in any service industry. I don't care if you like the bubble you live in, out here in the real world employees get little appreciation and even less real compensation. A billionaire that sits in meeting rooms and decides exactly how much money he wants to make by curtailing hiring and raises is making the money in his account off of the backs of others. If that doesn't make sense to you then I can't help you. Sorry, I'm not an elementary school teacher. If I could I would take you back to fifth grade economics and help you understand how money and capitalism actually work. As it were I'll just have to hope you read a book on the subject.

  69. Thomas Duensing

    So the guy who took the risks and did most of the work should give up his claim for some undefined, nebulous societal good and give it people who had nothing to do with it? That's what we call socialism. Historically it didn't work very well. While historically, capitalism has created more wealth and opportunity than any other system in the world, while pulling more people out of poverty than any other system. Compare North Korean and South Korea for a modern example.

  70. Thomas Duensing

    I would also like to see some proof that it is "on the backs of other people". The whole fallacy that because one person is rich, another one must be poor is a tenant of socialism, not capitalism.

  71. Thomas Duensing

    Minimum wage jobs were never intended to result in a "living wage" (look up the history). The idea of a living wage is construct of socialism not capitalism. If you want to live in a socialist country there are many to choose from–Greece or Spain or North Korea for example. Greed is wanting something you did not earn, not wanting to keep something you worked hard to earn. Also, there's a reason it is called "private property". If you want to claim ownership of someone elses private property, why not change the Constitution to allow you to claim their property?

  72. Thomas Duensing

    You're counting states when you should be counting individuals–it isn't the same thing. People should help each other out, but demanding something you did not earn is immoral and violates the private property rights of the owner. To a claim a right to something you did not earn means the person who did earn it does not have a right to it. That is absurd.

  73. Thomas Duensing

    Also, can you some me some facts to back this up: "Greedy people that want ten million dollar homes at the expense of minimum wage workers."

  74. Tina Marie Grubb

    Nobody wants anything that belongs to anyone else. It will not kill America if everyone has insurance. That has been proven. I don't need anyone else's property, I own mine, it is paid for. I will choose to spend or not spend my money as I see fit. It is a choice, you either stand with people or against them. I am standing with them. People need insurance, it is now law of land so time to get over it deal with whatever happens. This country has many programs that are considered socialism, they are good programs and they are needed. I have never had a problem with my tax dollars funding them. If you have a problem maybe you could consider that your tax dollars are going overseas to pay for wars or rebuilding those countries after the wars. I will keep my tax dollars at home paying for our socialized programs. Really you should consider not taking any Social Security because that would be considered Socialism.

  75. Tina Marie Grubb

    If you are going to flip at the lip, why don't you do some research. Obamacare was designed to benefit the business owner and it will also save hospitals money, the Federal Government will save and it is technically a blow job for the insurance companies. You people have no leg to stand on and neither do these businesses making a big fuss for the publicity.

  76. Bob Cipnic

    It's not how you make the money, it's how much of it you keep. The "robin Hood' of fable wasn';t greedy, would you say ? Yet he definitely took what wasn't his.

    Anyway, the definitions of greed I found were :

    From my trusty 1951 Webster's College Dict (pull it out to pre-empt the 'that's not what it used to mean!!' discussion) :
    "excessive desire for acquiring or having" "desire for more than one needs or deserves"

    From the Merriam-Webster's online :
    "a selfish and excessive desire for more of something (as money) than is needed "

    From Rogets online, some synonyms :
    greed [greed] Show IPA
    Part of Speech: noun
    Definition: overwhelming desire for more
    Synonyms: acquisitiveness, avarice, avidity, covetousness, craving, cupidity, eagerness, edacity, esurience, excess, gluttony, gormandizing, graspingness, hunger, indulgence, insatiableness, intemperance, longing, piggishness, rapacity, ravenousness, selfishness, swinishness, the gimmies, voracity
    Antonyms: benevolence, generosity
    Roget's 21st Century Thesaurus, Third Edition Copyright © 2012 by the Philip Lief Group.

    … notice NONE of them seem to make allowances for your methods of satisfying that greed.

    You're narrowing the definition, and I get it. You want to draw a line that will allow you to stand apart from the folks who would satisfy their greed by violating society's 'standards' and cheat or rob their way to wealth. But it's a division of your own making, and an insult to the intelligence of anyone who understands the actual meaning of the word 'greed'. The least you could have done was make some sort of "Greed is Good" Gordon Gecko-type argument.

    Or pitch some survivalist nonsense as a legitimate motivation for hoarding resources from others. You know "When America falls, the Romney's , Koch's & Shattner's will be there to see us through…", or something.

    Maybe the worst part is that these owners assumed we were all as callous as they were and would object to paying a few more cents for their products to see their employees insured.

  77. Thomas Duensing

    So who do you think pays for all of the entitlements? Are the people receiving them also paying the government for them? If so, why do we need the government in the middle? The money comes from the makers and gets distributed to others. Actually, we pay into social security–that's a lot different than not paying into it and demanding a part of it. And may I point out that social security is going broke? How does that help people? The social security system that you are using as an example of socialism is pretty funny since the system is failing. You really need a better example. How about the education system? Oops, we're not doing very well there either. Or maybe the postal system? Drat there's another example that isn't working. Socialism is great isn't it? Look at North and South Korea. Oops, sorry–another example that won't work for you. LOL. This is too easy.

  78. Pamela McCoy

    Tina Marie Grubb … already seen the increased premiums. The design is flawed.

  79. Tina Marie Grubb

    that's another myth. Social Security is not going broke. It is self sustainable until 2035, also it has steadily been robbed by members of congress. And yes, most of the people on Foodstamps and other programs work and pay taxes, the problem is greedy employers. You know back when Ford was first started he paid his workers enough to be able to afford the cars they made. Now these large corporations have taken over everything and have put most small businesses out. Why would you defend the ultra wealthy anyway. You are the one that needs to do some sole searching not the rest of us. It the postal system is so bad off why are they giving away free boxes for shipping Christmas gifts. If they can afford to ship gifts they can surely buy their own boxes. And why don't you look at the other countries who have universal insurance. None of this matters. You are just blowing smoke like the rest of the haters. You will all have to get over it. So carry on. I will not be responding to you anymore. Have a great life hating and belittling every good change in America. It will not stop them from happening. Progress is inevitable.

  80. Tina Marie Grubb

    According to CNNMoney, that is a bunch of hog wash.
    The cost of providing health care benefits to employees rose by just 4.1% this year, the smallest increase in 15 years, according to a survey by human resources consultant Mercer.

    And employers are expecting to see another modest increase of 5% next year, the survey of 2,800 companies found. That's a far cry from the beginning of the decade, when employers reported increases of 10% to nearly 15% a year. Last year, benefit costs rose by 6.1%.

  81. Vikki Schmitt

    Tommy boy: You must think distorting what I say makes you sound credible but it does not. It DOES make you sound just like the rest of the irrelevant crybaby losers who are furious that Karl Rove couldnt pull off another scam election and have your Mormon liar running the show. You–a Republican– have your nerve talking about right and wrong because you wouldnt know the difference if it hit you square between the eyes. Go to hell. Better yet, go to Texas and leave with the rest of the malcontents.

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